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[Naolein]

As we all know every hero in dota 5on5 has his job. And i really wanna increase the standard of this channel, but i also know that this is not IHCS or something.
If people fail one game... well shit can happen....We all fail time by time. I never requested someone for failing once , neither I requested someone by myself for low skill. But I am really tired of people just playing ego games and ignoring the LU and necessary Items, Conditions. Anyway im convinced that people who dont know their hero jobs in a certain LU, have a lack of experience. You can also call it ego playing. Maybe people dont share my opinion but thats what I want you guys to judge here.

I just had a game with this lineup.
http://rapidshare.com/files/151547127/oeoeoeoeoe.w3g.html

Spectre, Axe, Es, Abadon, and Storm VERSUS DK , Tiny, Ogre Mage, Sniper , Lesh

Axe went woods
Abadon was supposed to Babysit Spectre and both went bottom - VS Tiny Ogre
Storm soloed mid - VS DK
ES went top - VS Sniper Lesh

The game started and noone bought a chicken. Even people asked a chicken by supporter wasnt bought. Noone bought wards but thats not the main thing I am complaing about.

In this Lineup atleast for me - its clear that ES needs the dagger, axe needs the dagger, Storm is playing support and Abadon also playing support. But I got really mad, when Storm bought DMG, even people asked him to buy support stuff, Abadon went for DMG aswell, instead of Support and furthermore he deathcoiled CLEAR kills which SPECTRE really could need....

I really dont wanna accept the fact that people playing absolutely egoisticly! In DP euro , people can buy every item which every hero. Its okay if you do it there, but for me its not okay if you are playing with the XP Points of your teammates.

In my opinion, in this GAME , our heros definitly needed those items.
Axe Dagger + Mass HP
ES Dagger + and maybe disable ( but ES usually jumps and die if he has the only aoe ulti)
Storm - buying chicken, maybe eules , skilling the spell shield for spectre and the others, and guinsoos
Abadon - Meka , and he could have bought a guinsoos with the money he spent for dmg items....
Spectre - Std build

Its not a secret that DK is kinda overpowered atm and thats the reason why I dont understand people going for blabla builds :/

Hope you guys check the replay and tell me your opinion.

PS : Remember that every Lineup can change a heros job... If we wouldnt have a spectre in team, and we would have had a Shadowpriest ofc its Storms job to get the necessary dmg.

[BaHaya]

I've read through all your suggestions and I do agree with most of them. Maybe abadon could volunteer to buy chick but storm is most obvious choice. Don't agree with the euls for storm (but you said maybe so...), however a guinsoo was definitely needed so storm should get, midas is still nice for start item though.

Dunno if aba should have done meka but while armlet is an okay item for him perhaps it wasn't the best this game.

ES dagger is a given and Im 100% he was aiming for it as well, just that he had a bad game.

All in all it's an annoying game for you for sure but none of your m8s played so bad that they should be under surveillance imo. Spectre was lagging as he said so no farming for him early and teamplay was failing as well but that can happen in a bad game. Canøt really blame it on low skills.

Besides we had a much better team with carry and stun so it was a given that you would have a really hard time no matter what imo.

[zzark]

Abba = 100% more support then storm. Storm = dps which u should go silence or hex on!

[boomish]

In my opinion, in this GAME , our heros definitly needed those items.
Axe Dagger + Mass HP
ES Dagger + and maybe disable ( but ES usually jumps and die if he has the only aoe ulti)
Storm - buying chicken, maybe eules , skilling the spell shield for spectre and the others, and guinsoos
Abadon - Meka , and he could have bought a guinsoos with the money he spent for dmg items....
Spectre - Std build

I was actually in the same game as u, and i agree about the itembuild, if everything goes well, and spectre was able to farm, but he lagged bad and couldnt lasthit.
U were axe foresting right side, and i didnt see u stab 1 time to help us right side vs tiny and ogre- which is a pretty hard lane.
About the Armlet which u conclude is a damage item, i dont agree. I see it as a good damage and hp item, and the frost attack is good. but i could have made meka if u have told me to, but u didnt.
I totaly agree, that earth should have had dagger,and he knows that. THe problem was that he bought voidstone instead of saving up the money, and never got money for the item.
About storm.... He did make damage, which was a risky build, but maybe he saw, that spectra didnt farm or maybe he is used to make that build on normal pickup - because its sometime very imba.

About the game:
I play dota for the fun of it, but im still doing my best to win, and im rdy to play almost every hero, if im told and there is a plan. I just hate when ppl tell me what to do after 30 minutes, and im sure that storm was pretty annoyed too. Maybe thats why he didnt get guinsoo.

I can see u had a plan for the game. I just wonder, why didnt u say it in the beginning, so we could stick to the plan?

I think u destroyed the teamspirit, because u did complaine alot.

U cant win em all.

Btw they had better lineup.

[Naolein]

I did gang alot but with no disable its pretty hard to catch people.

The only thing I am trying to say here is, people should open their eyes in regard to line up and make a right decision about item build and hero jobs. Ofc there are different options of items in every game, but some are basics...

[Quaki]

Maybe it would have been of more use to talk about the lanes instead of the items...2bot lane + axe in woods can surely be nice for ganking there... but ES top vs Sniper Lesh... come on how can he ever farm a dagger there? if they play it good ES can be happy to get some xp on that lane, or not?...

imho it would have been far better to send spec+abba top and es bot where he can gank together with axe coming out of woods from time to time...

[GladiusZ]

I agree with Quaki. When someone jungles solo should always be mid and bot. Sending melee es against sniper and lesh top is gg right there. He will be under-leveled and under-farmed while sniper gets freefarm. Also storm shouldn't do support. He is itemdependent and needs farm to be useful. Abbadon should have gone full out support. With just meka he can do a lot of good for the team while being hard to kill. Just seems a lot went wrong this game. Can't really blame anyone in particular imo.

[boomish]

Maybe it would have been of more use to talk about the lanes instead of the items...2bot lane + axe in woods can surely be nice for ganking there... but ES top vs Sniper Lesh... come on how can he ever farm a dagger there? if they play it good ES can be happy to get some xp on that lane, or not?...

imho it would have been far better to send spec+abba top and es bot where he can gank together with axe coming out of woods from time to time...


I agree with u too.
We didnt talk and we failed.

[Fer0th]

Storm = mass dps imo lol!

[Naolein]

And thats exactly what I complain about.... Why do I need to tell the Spec and Abadon do go shortlane top because melee ES will have hard time VS Lesh Sniper? People should basicly see it at the start, or at least after 4 mins spending in Lane ....

Again i played a game yesterday with spectre in team + another semi carry...
I had Potm? ANd guess what? I used my brain and didnt go for DMG potm, I made a support potm, some people laugh about it, but no team need 3 dmg dealer?
I just went for fast meka, eules and guinsoos + maxing invis ulti, I roamed around, tried to grand spectre good stuns and kills + I kept map overview while farming to invis in time.

I dont wanna say with this example - LOOK IM COOL - Its just an example for the flexibility of heros..

[GladiusZ]

That's a lot of farm to make mirana a flexible hero^^. A support hero shouldn't take farm from the carry hero in order to support him. A real support hero doesn't need half that farm to be just as good support. I think it just comes down to picking. Someone should pick a good support hero and that someone should take the role as support that is minimum farm required to do your job. If you have to go support with a hero like mirana then your team has made bad picks from the start.

[Naolein]

I cant disagree on that ... But if thze picks are lick that , try to make the best out of it? IT was a 75 minute game...! so the best was basicly to go support!

[9det]

I think boom pretty much said all there is to say here.

Lack of communication, and those "suggestions" that only pop out after 3O mins (which i tend to consider as whine/flame/negative criticism in general) always trigger a negative effect.

Nothing wrong in lecturing your mates early about what should be done, some react bad (ex: "y please, teach me how to play dota") but then again a simple "you'll have to pay me first :)" with the smiley will purge any eventual bad mood and/or negative reaction, and will have people trying to make sure they're not the one screwing it up, because they went for what they thought was the right choice, instead of what the rest of the team was pointing out as the right choice.

Communicate better, flame less, smile more and you'll only have nice games :) (that's my personal recipe)

PS: oh and also don't validate games that you didn't play... that 6 days ban hurts :'(

[Naolein]

And if you tell your mates what to get and communicate that much, trying to lead them to right move, people flame you and say DONT TALK so much!

[avision]

Sending melee es against sniper and lesh top is gg right there. He will be under-leveled and under-farmed while sniper gets freefarm.

Well i actually got a doubble kill on them both, getting a total kill of 3 atleast though one to sentinel.
 But ye sure i could not stop them from farming, and i couldnt really get creeps. Though i was not underleveled, and i choose my voidstone, to make sure i could stop them from farming as best as i possible. Though i was expecting to get alittle bit of freefarming later for a faster dagger, unfortunally i did not.